I happened on this in my relatively small local library. A fascinating read, especially as I'm working on his Tempest V in 1/72. Clostermann pulls no punches, and is less than complimentary about the American pilots - he gives a couple of instances of RAF planes being attacked by P51/P47s.
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I've read the book two or three times now. Excellent account from the war. And as you say he's not very fond of the American effort. -
Yes, it is one superb book. A very honest and, brutally frank account of his exploits....Well worth a read (or two) I have it on my desk now and often have a dip into it.....If you want another superb read, get hold of 'The Forgotten Soldier' by Guy Sajer...The best book I've ever read by far!
Here are three pictures of Clostermann D.F.C. in his Tempest, 'Le Grand Charles', doing some train spotting....
Cheers,
Ron
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Treat Clostermann's book as a fact based novel rather than a historical document and enjoy it for the good read that it is.
To say he is a bit fast and loose with the facts would be an understatement!
I would apply the same caveat to several other wartime memoirs by well known pilots, from all sides,so please don't think I am singling out Clostermann.
Ron,I'd forgotten just how good your Clostermann dio is. it's a joy to see it again
Cheers
SteveComment
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Yes Steve, I had read elsewhere that his recollections were not very precise - you kind of get that impression from his writing style anyway. He does reinforce the notion that the Americans were trigger-happy cowboys.
Ron, that dio is terrific. Which model is that? I'm doing the Academy 1/72 - a great little kit.
TonyComment
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Steve what do you mean "A diorama"? The pictures were taken by a German manning a 100ft high flak tower!!
You are quite right about his book, but hey ho, fact, fiction, all in the melting pot....out comes a great read and well written!
Glad you like my cheeky insertion of the pictures Tony....I must confess to being unsure as to whether to post them, but knowing what a great bunch of blokes there are on here, I hoped they would be accepted in the spirit they were included...I was right, thank goodness!
The kit is the 1/72 Tempest V by Heller, a nice, simple little kit with very good decals, incl. 'Le Grand Charles'.
Best of luck with your Tempest and keep us posted of progress....
Cheers,
RonComment
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Hi Tony. It's a terrific read,better than many of those from his contemporaries. I suppose they all try to make there books/memoirs as exciting as they can otherwise we wouldn't buy them! His memory is a bit imprecise as you so nicely put it.Originally posted by \
It would be quite wrong to characterise the American pilots as any more trigger happy than anyone else. It is no accident that all combatant Air Forces were forever devising tactical markings to help identify friend from foe.
Ask any Fleet Air Arm pilot about the trepidation with which he would approach any Royal Navy vessel,launching the relevant flares and endeavouring to identify himself as friendly in any way he could.
Even the most famous could be caught out by friendly fire. Bader springs to mind,almost certainly shot down by Flt.Lt. Lionel 'Buck' Casson of 616 Squadron.
Cheers
SteveComment
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Read this some time ago. Found it a couple of months ago in my library & decided to read it again.
Got past chapter one then remembered & decided it was so flowery. I was not sure of it's content in terms of fiction & reality. He could certainly turn it on.
But it is a fair read. But then found Fly for your Life by Larry Foster about Bob "Tommy" Tuck. Bit of embroidery there as well but some great descriptions especially the bit just read his first trip in a Spit with Jeff Quill in charge. Very descriptive.
Great to see that people are still reading books. Not sure of your libraries but ours in Jersey has about 40 feet of shelves for WW11. Also a large section on Large Books with pictures. I always come home with 6 books then have to drag them back after 3 weeks with only 2 read as I can never decide at the library the choice being to great.
LaurieComment
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Some people don't class it as friendly fire. Some say it was to save many of the other pilots on the sqn from being used as cannon fodder by Bader. Having talked to quite a few people that served with Bader (engineers and pilots), many of them have the same opinion about him..... and it's not a nice one.Originally posted by \Comment
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All part of the myth I'm afraid.Originally posted by \
Casson claimed an Me 109 [sic],even saying that the empennage broke off and that he saw the pilot bail out. That's pretty much what happened to Bader. The Luftwaffe didn't lose any Bf 109s in this area that day.
Bader was not a popular man but he was well respected. His apologists have suggested that he claimed,in "Reach for the Sky", to have been downed in a collision to protect the pilot (Casson) of the other Spitfire involved. I don't buy that either. It was a simple "friendly" fire incident. Bader had no idea what hit him and was unwilling to concede that he'd been caught on the hop.
I have a signed copy of "Reach for the Sky", which incidentally falls into the same category as Clostermann's book but is also a shameless bit of self promotion.Unfortunately it was signed for and to my brother! I expect he'll want that back one day
Here's a rather poor copy of a photograph allegedly taken a few days after Bader was taken prisoner. He is meeting Galland amongst others and it seems to be a fairly jovial affair.
Cheers
SteveComment
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Very interesting article Tony.Some very detailed accounts.
Think though we have missed a trick includes me. Thought about this matter last night & was sad to see that I had not looked in depth. We all looked at what Closterman, Bader & Tuck & what had been written about these pilots but had forgotten their deeds.
Pierre Closterman, like a great group of Frenchmen, had travelled to Britain to continue their war with the RAF. Let down by their strategic leader, General Vuillemin head of the French Airforce, who was about as useful as a fly swat against a Spifire. Yet Closterman was thro & thro French & a patriot.
Douglas Bader first he had lost his legs & must have had major discomfort & pain. Could easily have stayed at home ! He was determined that Britain was British & nobody else would have it. Yes he made a few friendly enemies but only as he was determined to see that all thought & fought like him. A British patriot thro & thro.
Forgiven that he entered into strategy rather than his job of tatics. Unfortunate at his young age he had Leigh Mallory as his boss a determined yet weak leader. He should have curbed Bader after all Leigh Mallory was the Strategist not Bader. Or should have been.
Bob Tuck nearly, all but, failed as a pilot yet became one of the best. Some body had second vision a lesson there. Bob Tuck shot down 5 on his first day in the battle over the Dunkirk area. Suddenly made Squadron Leader designate after a few days after major losses. Flinched not. Led, inspired & started bigger numerical attacks & realized immediately that the RAF battle formation was hopeless & originated his own on such short experience. A realist with imagination & the initiative to change it on his own.
A bit of magic. Out of the mist on the runway Bader appeared. What’s the score old boy. All fired at great speed & in a belligerent manner.
Tuck apparently annoyed thought “what has this old prune to act so tough about”.
"Have not a clue" said Tuck.
Tuck noticed he had a silk stocking around his neck & Tuck said, as Bader walked away lurching & swearing ,“would not fly with that around your neck”.
Barder stopped & “Why the hell not”.
Tuck “cos you will get it stuck in your canopy if you bale out.
Bader walked off snorting & muttering.
Tuck says I remember this obstreperous man- much to cocky.
Tuck & Bader became great friends.
When met after the war typically Bader would say “Bobbie you old scrounger- go home before you get drunk”.
Tuck “Belt up you rude sod”.
I like it.
But all the above shows the absolute spirit to preserve their homelands. French Polish & British plus the Commonwealth or Empire as it was. It was absolute & they were spearheads of that determination that nothing should pass. Just “Right of the line”. And I do not mind saying I am proud of the whole lot of them. I was then as a young boy & still now as an old (young) man.
Laurie
Apologies not Ron but Tony started the article.
PS absolute oversight. Dowding. What with out him would have happened a strategist supreme. He had to use a minimum force with the state changing day to day. Parks, his man down in 11 Group, daily changing & following Strategy & Tactics. A remarkable team. Neither treated well afterwards. Pretty awful.Comment
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