discussion 1/87 Four Deuce Chem. mortar section

[minitnkr]

My ref. material is less than stellar for this project, so comments/criticisms are encouraged as I plunge ahead. Much of what I have read indicates they originally used 2.5 ton trucks but they were too noisy & ungainly in Sicily/Italy action. Some sources say they went to 3/4 ton WCs & others say jeeps w/trailers. I am favoring the WC (beep) option as these were self sufficient units and used a lot of ammunition. Also have some photo evidence. I'm using ROCO WCs, 1/4 ton trailers OOB pretty much and am also using the ROCO 81mm mortars as the basis for the 4.2" (107mm) conversion as they were way too big to use as intended. Progress pic so far. They also were expected to provide their own security so I'm giving them a MA Deuce & some bazookas.
View attachment 313004
PaulE

 

[Guest]

Paul.
Your straight in with this, nice bazooka's in the front there. How many would they have had.? Will grab a seat before the Rabble arrive.
Dzhon.

 

[Steve Jones]

More miniature madness:thumb2: You have a lot on the go at the moment. How many vehicles are involved in this project now??

 

[minitnkr]

Gen. Patton was so impressed w/their performance in Italy he said no regiment should deploy to Europe w/o at least an attached company of these very accurate and effective mortars. PaulE

 

[minitnkr]

Dzohn, my guess from several unit narratives was the battalion of 36 tubes (after 9/43 reduced from 48 due to crew shortages) tried to get the companies of twelve tubes each 13 bazookas & 50cal. MGs. because of many instances of crews having to defend their positions. I may have misspoke previously confusing platoon/section terms. Section consists of 8 men (not enough) to 1 mortar (36 tube battalion). PaulE

 

[minitnkr]

Steve, upon further research I've replaced 2 1/2ton trucks & assoc. trailers with 3/4ton trucks with 1/4ton trailers in the mortar platoon. PaulE

 

[minitnkr]

Further progress on chem mortar platoon. You can see the bazooka stowed at the windshield.
View attachment 313266
The mortar is in the trailer to keep it lined up while cement dries
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Skin oil has etched these tweezers over the years. You can just make out the tiny 2nd Chemical decals.
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C&Cs welcomed. PaulE

 

[minitnkr]

Thanks Mick. Because these were managed by the Chemical Warfare Service & nobody was using gas they were the "red haired stepchild" of the supply chain, so were always short of everything assoc. with conventional war fighting. Often causing Corp & Army leaders to intervene. Units sometimes manufactured their own spare parts in local factories.
The German prisoners in Italy thought they were automatic cannon due to the quantity of rounds hitting so close with such ferocity. Their explosive power was equal to the 10.5cm howitzer but a good crew could get 30 rounds a minute in the air for short periods. Multiply this by 48 tubes in a company & you get the idea. The tubes would overheat sometimes causing the round to launch before hitting the trigger. Once so hot the trigger melted. The rifled tube 'goon gun' accuracy was legendary. 15 rounds in a 30' radius not unusual. Anecdotes of taking out snipers with one round & taking out individual tanks bolstered their reputation. PaulE

 

[Guest]

Going to look the part Paul .
Just been told my bench is getting like yours :thumb2: that is quite impressive :smiling5:
Dzhon

 

[minitnkr]

Thanks Dzohn & Mick. We know where stuff is.....usually.
More progress, mortars & personal weapons almost ready for paint.
I must confess, jeeps w/trailers are usually around $20@ whereas WCs are more like $4 to $8@. TO&E hints at two jeeps with trailers/mortar & one WC/mortar, so economics has influenced my choice of vehicle after reading 2 1/2 trucks were out of the picture. Plus I had some extra WCs & 1/4ton trailers.
View attachment 313355
C&Cs encouraged. PaulE

 

[Guest]

Think its always a good sign when your nearly ready to hurl some paint.
Knowing where stuff is ...... Well it was here once, but that was 10 minutes ago ! :smiling2:
Dzhon

 

[Mini Me]

Paul,
Looking good and coming together rather quickly. Thanks for the back ground info...always creates a lot more interest!
Rick H.

 

[PJR]

Mortars looking good, thanks for sharing!

 

[Steve Jones]

Wonderful work as always Paul. Unfortunately you are going to have to educate an idiot. Where do the mortars go please?

 

[minitnkr]

On clear firm ground, Steve, but not rock. Usually a thousand yards behind the front line for smoke operations. For infantry support, wherever needed. Sometimes right up front. They were limited to an effective range of 2000yds very early, but were firing out to over 4000 by late 44. They tried a couple sp mounts, but none passed trials. A side note--they lost a platoon per company when they were reduced to 36 tubes so the companies were three 4 tube platoons. So now I have to come up w/another WC & "goon gun". PaulE

 

[minitnkr]

A couple pics of a possible composition test fit.
View attachment 313651
Foreground WC going for more ammo. The other three are in various stages of offloading. Just a thought. Opinions/criticisms encouraged. PaulE
View attachment 313652

 

[Allen Dewire]

Evening Moses Paul,

I take it the Engineers were called up for a new mission and the Mortars came in and made themselves at home. I love your bases as you can always re-use them in so many ways. I still can't believe you work in this scale and always make such detailed vehicles and scenes. The only contact I have ever had with mortars was in Berlin and they were mounted in M-106's (modified 113's). I think the layout looks good, but maybe the mortars a bit more forward and the vehicles between the tents and the mortars. Just a thought….
Have a great Sunday and I hope it's cooled off a bit my friend.

Prost
Allen

 

[minitnkr]

Thanks Allen. A good thought, I'll try it. The rain last night & today brought mid 60s F temps. PaulE

 

[Mini Me]

Man, how you folks in Ohio suffer! I like the layout. Allen is correct in that the scene is very homogeneous with the base. Perhaps some mortar crews to create a little action.
Regards, Rick H.

 

[Tim Marlow]

Like this thread, history and cracking modelling..and it’s nice to see whole units in dios. It gives an idea of the sheer scale of military operations not possible with one or two vehicle displays...