discussion A slight rant

[AlanG]

Something has been nagging me for ages and after yet another internet trawl to find information/reviews on certain kits i have come to the same conclusion every time.

Famous 'expert builders' that seem to put these reviews/builds onto such sites as IPMS/aircraftresourcecenter etc etc all seem to be unable to make a kit and review it's pros and cons without the need to add aftermarket bits/decals or scratch build. All i ask for is an OOB review build but it seems almost impossible to find these days. Maybe it's below them to cater for us lesser mortals and our shoddy attempts at builds (tongue in cheek for that bit :tongue: )

In some ways it's why i love this forum so much. Here we generally build OOB and show up the said pros and cons with the kits (also our own techniques at times).

Sorry if this seems a pointless rant but it was just something i wanted to say.

 

[papa 695]

I think i know where your coming from. There like saying the kits not very good unless you spend ££££ on after market stuff

 

[stona]

It's not pointless. Many of them get their freebies from the manufacturers,hardly an incentive for a warts and all review. I don't tar everyone with the same brush but I've built kits which seem to have been entirely different to the one reviewed!

You are also correct that most of us are not master modellers,just mortals having a go and building for fun and enjoyment. We all hope to improve but that's never been the point of building for me. I'm always comfortable showing a 'walkaround' of my models here,if one angles not so good it's not so good,I don't mind,I'm not in a competition!

Cheers

Steve

 

[yak face]

Good point al, they do seem to be unable to do something OOB dont they? Aftermarket accessories are great but some of the reviews seem to be saying that without them a kits not worth doing or inferior in some way. A lot of the time too, aftermarket stuff will be used when it doesnt really make much of an improvement over the kit supplied items, ie, some tamiya stuff has lovely cockpits OOB but they will grind it out and use a resin replacement which looks the same!!! I know seat belts are a different kettle of fish - rarely supplied, very hard to scratchbuild and a very noticeable area , so i dont mind if theyre always used. tony

 

[Guest]

Its good to get it of your chest Al , I like a rant now and then so go for it mate , agree with all the lads above although sometimes its nice to use AM stuff when finances allow its not always necessary , I do like AM decals but with PE I never use it all - its either too small for my fat fingers or my skill level or its no better than the kit parts ,

Richy

 

[Guest]

i have just been given a huge collection of model airplane magazines and have been flicking through them for a few days and you are quite right, there are none so far that dont have mention of some sort of pe or resin replaacement in them. some modellers(ME) are on a tight budget and even if i wanted too, couldnt afford all these bits and bobs. if these bits are so critical to make a decent model maybe kit manufacturers should include them in the kit like dragon do.(i can dream cant i).of course the prices of the kits would shoot up then and they are dear enough now.

 

[AlanG]

That's my point Andrew. They seem to cater to the people that can obviously afford Am stuff and not the youth and not so well off people (who in my opinion are the backbone of the hobby). How are you going to keep the youth interested in the hobby when they think that they just have to buy all the extra stuff just to make a good model.

Mine aren't up to show standard and i don't care. As long as i have fun making it and am happy to see it sitting in my display cabinet afterwards then that's all that matters in my book.

Don't get my wrong i have a few kits that have a few extras in it (like my 1/32 Tornado) and i will be building them with it. But for the most part all my builds are OOB

 

[Guest]

Agree with you 100%

I like to use aftermarket stuff but a kit review that includes them is very unhelpful

It's a strong point of forums like this, people generally tell it like it is

 

[Ian M]

I agree Allyne. I sometimes wonder if they are reviewing the kit or all the add ons you can get for them. One site I have found to be quite reasonable, with the majority of the reviews I have read being OOB, is Modelling madness. AND in many if not most of the reviews there paid for buy the reviewer, so no tendancy for bias. The down side is that the newer kits are quite a while before they get reviewed.

As for the excessive use of add ons, they are building a kit primarily for the review but also for their own shelves once done, so I can understand it to a point. Especially if coming out of their own pocket. As on MM.

Still don't make for a good review though.

If I where ever asked to do some thing like that (and pigs might fly) I dare say that I to would go the whole nine yards if some one else was footing the bill.

What we need is a tame shop owner that is willing to sacrifice a new release once in a while so we can have a review section here on the forum........

Ian M

 

[AlanG]

What we need is a tame shop owner that is willing to sacrifice a new release once in a while so we can have a review section here on the forum........Ian M

Do we have to call him 'The Stig' ?

 

[stona]

The issue is that many,if not most,of us will build kits essentially out of the box. The reviewers are usually building for publication and can't help showing off a bit with all the extras. They are also promoting the extras which are often produced by fairly small operations,sometimes one man in his garage! They need all the promotion they can get. I don't really have a problem with that.

A build with after market add ons should still give an idea of how the basic kit fits and looks. If it doesn't it is a bad review and there are plenty of them about.

There's room for everybody in the hobby. If you want to and can afford to stuff your model full of goodies then go for it,I'll just watch from the sidelines. I made a decision some time ago to cut back on after market goodies on financial grounds. They were starting to cost more than the kits! Now I usually just stick in a harness (though these now often are included in larger scale kits). I occasionally buy after market decals for a particular subject if I can't make them up from spares or paint them.

You will often find that a fellow modeller has already built one of your intended victims on a forum such as this. He will have bought his own kit and should be able to give an honest opinion of it. I've done a few builds here and try to be honest. I won't slag a kit off,particularly a limited run,specialist kit, as that isn't helpful. I will certainly say if the fit is tricky or if a lot of work is needed in certain areas.

Cheers

Steve

 

[Guest]

Having less than one year in this mad world producing minatures of objects 70 years old I have realised the simple thing.

That if a model went together perfectly. Then very boring for one thing & the skills of building & producing a model would not be there when you come up against one that needed them.

I have seen the same models portrayed on forums & they look different. One a skilled model maker the other, yuks me. Just to qualify I am improving----- a bit.

Laurie

 

[Vaughan]

I too agree with Allyne. It can be quite off putting when these reviewers have tweaked and altered the basic model almost out of recognition. We just want to know if it's a good model to build.

Vaughan

 

[geegad]

Amen to that.... I don't buy after Market products as they seem to be as pricey as the original model more inportant things to spend my money on more kits and bills.

I've seen models on here with and without and you never can tell whether it pe or plastic when it's got paint on its all down to personal choise

Anyway I'm off now to clean my gold diamond encrusted shoes

Geegad

 

[Guest]

Hi Allyne,

Completely agree, in fact I am guilty of buying after market products, but have decided in future just to built strictly OOB, a lot of the after market products I find don't really add much to the aircraft, O.K. there are a few exceptions if you are building old Airfix kits for example, but I find things become too serious, and some of the fun goes out the window. Cheers Derek

p.s. Have heard it refered to as ABS 'advanced builders syndrome' although I don't class myself as advanced, I hasten to add.

 

[Guest]

I have to agree, it does annoy you when you read the articles within a magazine or on a forum that is dedicated to model building, that the builder has decided to throw a lot of money at it in order to enhance the kit.

I also agree that the choice is down to the modeller how he or she should build their kits, and if that means adding resin or pe items, then that is their choice, but i would also like to see more models built straight from the box.

Not everyone has the funds to be able to buy pe or resin items to enhance the kits that they are building, and it does appear as if the so called expert builders are implying that this needs to be the way, the kits are expensive as they are, and as most folk know so are the resin and pe items!

They should do more in these articles within the magazines to let modellers see that when you are building a kit you dont have to add lots of pe or resin to make the kit look good, simple things such as weathering and chipping goes a long way in making any kit come to life as does a good paint job!

Tom

 

[stona]

Concentrate on building and painting a model well. You can throw all the after market goodies money can buy at a kit but it won't improve it if it is badly built and painted. It will just make it a more expensive badly built model :sad:

Cheers

Steve

 

[Guest]

Although I completely understand the rant that kicked this topic off, I've got to say I think stona (Steve) makes a lot of sense in reply #11

In the most part, reviewers do comment as to why they may be using AM stuff, and it serves the double purpose of giving an opinion on the OOB item and the AM item, helpful to many modellers I would have thought.

Although I build only OOB, I find reference to AM stuff quite interesting.

 

[Gern]

It would be really nice if the reviewers showed us the original kit parts as well as the extra bits. Then we'd be able to decide for ourselves whether we think the kit needs them to satisfy our own personal desire for detail. Not everybody wants/can afford replacement parts that only add miniscule details which can barely be seen.

And like Steve said, you'll get much better looking kits by using good building skills rather than by throwing money at them.

Gern

 

[stona]

I've put in a few resin/PE cockpit sets in my time. Now I can't see them and don't even remember which models they are in! Buying parts to alter a base kit into something else is another matter entirely. I believe it was Trey who did a great conversion using vac-form parts recently. After market decals,for me,fall into this category.

There are other parts which are sometimes worth improving,a nice set of metal,turned,barrels on a Ju87 'kanonenvogel' for example. We all have to decide where we want to draw the line.

I think we are debating the emphasis of many reviews. I don't mind them using AM sets but they should not lose sight of their primary aim which is to review what's in the box. That is what most of us will buy.

I think Allyne is quite right to complain that many reviews lose sight of this.

Cheers

Steve