discussion Sturmgeschutz IV (First tank build/paint)

[Guest]

Hello,


So over the weekend I purchased my first Tamiya tank after deciding to get back into modelling, which has been at least 10 years ago when I was about 16.


I've finished building the tank but have left it in separate pieces for ease of priming and painting.


Just a few questions and some advice needed before I get started on this.


Firstly, what brand of primer should I go for? Anything along the lines of Black or Dark Grey.


Secondly, I have read a few posts about mixing Tamiya Dark Yellow and Deck Tan together to give a better overall/accurate colour than a straight Dark Yellow base colour. I would then like to add a filter to this but I am not sure on which filter I need?


Final question about weathering. When adding pigment like AK Track dust, do you always mix it with white spirit? (I know AK have their own white spirit but not sure if any old white spirit will do)


When adding AK Rust Streaks, do you always use a little bit of thinner by itself on a brush to blend it? And if so do you blend while still damp or once its dry?


That's all my questions for now, I apologise in advance as I'm sure I will have a few more. I like to be thorough and know all I can before starting things like this lol


Thanks again.

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[Steve Brodie]

Final question about weathering. When adding pigment like AK Track dust, do you always mix it with white spirit? (I know AK have their own white spirit but not sure if any old white spirit will do)

Depends, i usually dab it on dry and brush off what i dont want, then if i want to fix the pigments i drop some Tamiya x20a on with a dropper and let capillary action do the rest, if your not going to touch the model a lot, you can get away without using any sort of fixer, i tend to find that 'commercial' white spirit tends to turn any pigment a bit darker once dry.

When adding AK Rust Streaks, do you always use a little bit of thinner by itself on a brush to blend it? And if so do you blend while still damp or once its dry?

Again i find it tends to be whatever effect you are looking for, i would thin it down a bit, add a point and 'draw' a thin line downwards, leave for a few minutes then with a damp flat brush (with thinners) draw down over the line to blend it it subtley

 

[Guest]

Depends, i usually dab it on dry and brush off what i dont want, then if i want to fix the pigments i drop some Tamiya x20a on with a dropper and let capillary action do the rest, if your not going to touch the model a lot, you can get away without using any sort of fixer, i tend to find that 'commercial' white spirit tends to turn any pigment a bit darker once dry.


Again i find it tends to be whatever effect you are looking for, i would thin it down a bit, add a point and 'draw' a thin line downwards, leave for a few minutes then with a damp flat brush (with thinners) draw down over the line to blend it it subtley

Thanks for the advice Steve.


Theres so many different weathering techniques that its abit mind boggling! So basically I can apply it dry without even having to dampen the pigment or even seal it? (Apart from the final protective coat to seal the whole model).


Any idea on what filter to use for dark yellow/desert colours?


Cheers.

 

[Steve Brodie]

Theres so many different weathering techniques that its abit mind boggling! So basically I can apply it dry without even having to dampen the pigment or even seal it? (Apart from the final protective coat to seal the whole model).

Yep, unless you want a wet effect, then you can use a gloss, semi gloss varnish to seal the pigments.

Any idea on what filter to use for dark yellow/desert colours?

You could use a brown (sienna) colour, make it with oil paints / enamels thinned to a translucent thickness and apply or you can buy it ready made from Vallejo / AK


AK dark yellow wash AK Afrika Korps Wash Vallejo Dark Brown Wash

 

[Guest]

Would those ready made washes need to be thinned down since they arent filters? Just curious as I read about the differences between washes and filters. 

 

[Guest]

Also what primers are best? I do not own an airbrush so it will have to be the aerosol kind. Preferably black or grey.


Thanks.

 

[Guest]

Would those ready made washes need to be thinned down since they arent filters? Just curious as I read about the differences between washes and filters. 

The "when is a wash not a filter?" question catches us all out Marty! The link below has 3 articles about doing rain streaking (which can be adapted for rust streaks), filters & pigments. 


With filters, the most important thing to remember is that they're to be applied on a matt surface. Most washes are applied to a gloss surface.


If you're doing a German camo scheme, a brownish filter is best to tie the various colours together.


HTH


Patrick

 

[Guest]

The "when is a wash not a filter?" question catches us all out Marty! The link below has 3 articles about doing rain streaking (which can be adapted for rust streaks), filters & pigments. 


With filters, the most important thing to remember is that they're to be applied on a matt surface. Most washes are applied to a gloss surface.


If you're doing a German camo scheme, a brownish filter is best to tie the various colours together.


HTH


Patrick

I dont think your link has worked Patrick? 


So basically it goes: 


Primer


Base Coat


Lighter Base Coat


Filter


Then seal all of that with a gloss varnish? 


Im not going for any camo schemes atm as I dont have an airbrush and this is my first kit. But im going for a Dark Yellow base coat then a Dark Yellow/Tan shade ontop of the flat raised areas

 

[Guest]

Ah that's because I foolishly forgot to add the link!   here it is


http://missing-lynx.com/rareworld.htm


It is possible to do a reasonable camo pattern using aerosols. I did it many years back by cutting out thin wavy slits of thick card. The card is then held close to the model, but not touching. Spraying the aerosol gives a result that's similar to using an airbrush.


However, if you go with your monotone plan, a filter won't be needed. That's really only used with tri-colour German camouflage schemes.


If it were my model, the sequence would be:


Primer


Base coat


Lightened base coat 


Gloss coat


Decals


Pin wash (burnt umber)


Matt Coat


Chipping


Rain or rust streaks


Pigments


There might be some extra weathering using oils prior to adding the pigments, but that's more advanced.


Cheers


Patrick

 

[Guest]

Ah that's because I foolishly forgot to add the link!   here it is


http://missing-lynx.com/rareworld.htm


Cheers


Patrick

Great link Patrick, very helpful mate. 

 

[Guest]

Ah that's because I foolishly forgot to add the link!   here it is


http://missing-lynx.com/rareworld.htm


It is possible to do a reasonable camo pattern using aerosols. I did it many years back by cutting out thin wavy slits of thick card. The card is then held close to the model, but not touching. Spraying the aerosol gives a result that's similar to using an airbrush.


However, if you go with your monotone plan, a filter won't be needed. That's really only used with tri-colour German camouflage schemes.


If it were my model, the sequence would be:


Primer


Base coat


Lightened base coat 


Gloss coat


Decals


Pin wash (burnt umber)


Matt Coat


Chipping


Rain or rust streaks


Pigments


There might be some extra weathering using oils prior to adding the pigments, but that's more advanced.


Cheers


Patrick

Thanks for the link, just had a read this morning and it was really helpful!


I've been looking all over for guides on how to correctly mix ratios but can't seem to find anything! Do you have a link or anything that can help as I don't think I fully understand how ratios work with paint.


Also can you guys recommend me a good aerosol Primer?


Thanks again.

 

[Guest]

Thanks for the link, just had a read this morning and it was really helpful!


I've been looking all over for guides on how to correctly mix ratios but can't seem to find anything! Do you have a link or anything that can help as I don't think I fully understand how ratios work with paint.


Also can you guys recommend me a good aerosol Primer?


Thanks again.

THe gunze Mr surfacer spraycans are very good primers

 

[Guest]

Thanks for the link, just had a read this morning and it was really helpful!


I've been looking all over for guides on how to correctly mix ratios but can't seem to find anything! Do you have a link or anything that can help as I don't think I fully understand how ratios work with paint.


Also can you guys recommend me a good aerosol Primer?


Thanks again.

Mixing ratios are as much a matter of personal choice as they are a fixed rule.


If I'm airbrushing, then it'll be 60:40 with enamels or 80:20 with 'airbrush ready' acrylics.


For brush painting, it's a case of suck it & see! There's no right or wrong ratio for brushing.


If you have a well ventilated room, Tamiya Fine Surface Primer is excellent, if very smelly. Many people use automotive plastic primer, rather than a more expensive modelling product.

 

[Guest]

Mixing ratios are as much a matter of personal choice as they are a fixed rule.


If I'm airbrushing, then it'll be 60:40 with enamels or 80:20 with 'airbrush ready' acrylics.


For brush painting, it's a case of suck it & see! There's no right or wrong ratio for brushing.


If you have a well ventilated room, Tamiya Fine Surface Primer is excellent, if very smelly. Many people use automotive plastic primer, rather than a more expensive modelling product.

Yeah I guess your right on that one!


So just some Halfords Primer which I've heard a lot of people mentioning.


I do have Games Workshop White Primer left over which I was considering to just spray on but not to keen on white for priming.


Cant wait to get a start on the painting, just hope I don't find the Tamiya acrylics as bad as everyone says they are for brush painting :|  I will be applying the thinner and doing very light coats so hopefully all goes well.