discussion Border Models 1/32 Lancaster

[Bigfoot57]

Well I decided to have a look at the sprues I’ve selected a few photos just let you see the exquisite detail I apologise for the sprues still sealed in their respective bags
All Ive done so far is take around 50 photos 1 of each sprue to check for damage so far I can’t see any which is good

Regards

Colin

 

[Jim R]

Hi Colin
Glad there's no damaged parts. Even in the bags the detail looks good.
Jim

 

[Bigfoot57]

Yep looks fine to me just got to build it now but I’m struggling with interior colours yes it was black and some sort of cockpit green there’s a load of differing opinions on that as there are not many if any original colour photos of a mk1 and the only references we have are the BOBMF and Just Jane and I believe a Canadian and these are all restorations from after 1944 parts etc
Example the handrail from the bomb aimers position some say it’s yellow some say it’s white and some say green or black
And what of all that internal wiring and little boxes and piping the pilots seat the instrument panel seatbelts parachutes etc that this kit has so wonderfully moulded it can’t be all black or green that I’m sure of so until I have more reference material I don’t want to start it yet
Regards
Colin

 

[Bigfoot57]

Here’s an enlargement of part of 1 of the sprues hopefully showing the detail they have moulded into this kit

 

[Tim Marlow]

Looks great. Hope you get the source material together because it looks like most of the work on this beast will be sorting out and painting the inside. Pity it wasn’t released by Wingnut though, they were excellent at this sort of thing.

 

[Jim R]

Impressive. Painting will take a lot of patience. As Tim says reliable references will be vital.

 

[Ian M]

Put my neck on the block here.
If a British built RAF aircraft the green interior would have been raf interior grey green.
Wiring would have been sheathed, just like a home or car, wires of different colours either taped up or in cloth sheathing. Most likely black or brown. Pipes? Brass copper or steel.
Function was higher on the list than pretty to look at...and even a million pound ferrari the wiring is black! Lol

 

[Ian M]

Impressive. Painting will take a lot of patience. As Tim says reliable references will be vital.

Stona to the rescue...

 

[AlanG]

HK Models colour call outs: https://www.scalemates.com/products/img/4/9/1/1335491-98-instructions.pdf

 

[Bigfoot57]

Alan thanks for that reference that will prove very useful
Colin

 

[prichrd1]

Colin,

When it comes to the Lanc, I think most modellers have an interest and at some point have built at least one :smiling: :smiling:

As far as interior colours go it was painted mainly interior green and most of the "visible" cockpit painted black -
The hand rail you see painted in yellow IMHO is a modern H&S addition to highlight it.

The photo - bottom right corner, shows a section of the handrail leading to the bomb aimer's position.




Photo courtesy of this web site :

Lanc Page

HTH on your epic quest

Paul.
:smiling:

 

[Andy the Sheep]

Colin, I'll get a first row seat (with cushion :rolling and follow with great interest your build.

Andrea

 

[prichrd1]

Colin, I'll get a first row seat (with cushion :rolling and follow with great interest your build.

I'm going to sit on me stool, quietly in the corner.
And can you bring out the "good biscuits" it will keep the rabble quiet !!
Saves matron using her tranquilliser gun !!!
:smiling: :tears-of-joy::smiling::thumb2:

Paul.
:smiling:

 

[BarryW]

Yep looks fine to me just got to build it now but I’m struggling with interior colours yes it was black and some sort of cockpit green there’s a load of differing opinions on that as there are not many if any original colour photos of a mk1 and the only references we have are the BOBMF and Just Jane and I believe a Canadian and these are all restorations from after 1944 parts etc
Example the handrail from the bomb aimers position some say it’s yellow some say it’s white and some say green or black
And what of all that internal wiring and little boxes and piping the pilots seat the instrument panel seatbelts parachutes etc that this kit has so wonderfully moulded it can’t be all black or green that I’m sure of so until I have more reference material I don’t want to start it yet
Regards
Colin

I suggest taking the lazy route, watch Nigel’s Modeling Bench build reviews on YouTube. He has and is doing a lot of research into his build and I don’t think you can go wrong by latching on to the colours he uses. He openly discusses the colour options and why he makes the decisions he has. I do think his build is a must watch for anyone with this kit. I will certainly be paying it a lot of attention as I go through mine.

 

[stona]

I think interior colours for the Lancaster are a bit of a minefield.

Early production certainly had interior green interiors, but these were often painted night/black, at least the forward section as far back as the navigators station at a major service interval. The A.V.Roe Co Ltd camouflage drawing Z1723 of 31/3/41 specifies only that 'the interior of the bomb compartment, undercarriage compartment including doors and interior of wing flaps are to be painted Night'. If you are making an early production aircraft, welcome to the minefield.

Later aircraft are generally assumed to have been completed with a black/Night forward section (and turret interiors), but I'm not convinced its as simple as that.

'F' Freddie at the IWM is supposedly in the condition in which it was taken out of service...and.



The bomb aimer's station is black/Night. Freddie is DV372, part of the third production batch from Metropolitan Vickers, delivered sometime between May and November 1943. I have read that different factories completed the aircraft with different finishes, but I can't comment on that (because I don't know). That area under the glass at the rear of the cockpit would have been finished in the Dark Green camouflage colour, and something has happened to that.

Unfortunately, there are few if any genuine colour images of Lancaster interiors from the period. Interpreting black and white images is always going to involve some assumptions and guess work.

The BBMF Lancaster (orig. PA474) is a very late production aircraft, part of the first production batch from Vickers-Armstrong Ltd Chester. The first were delivered in June 1944, the last in September 1945. It is obviously not in original condition, but the BBMF, certainly in the last twenty/thirty years, has made an effort to keep things looking as they would have done. I would not discount it as a reference.

 

[stona]

Re: Black and white images.

The first two are of the navigator and wireless operator's stations. I think most of us would interpret the overall interior colour as interior green.





So what colour is the cockpit framing and other light areas (not equipment or instrument panels) in this image of a flight engineer on his 'dicky seat'.



It's difficult to see that as black, in my opinion.

As for genuine colour images, what do you make of the interior colour that can be glimpsed in this image?



Like I said, it's a minefield

 

[prichrd1]

So what colour is the cockpit framing and other light areas

Could that be the exterior green colour??
Can o worms and dunkelgelb spring to mind !!!! :smiling:

And don't forget the pull curtain located behind the pilot's station !!

Paul.
:smiling:

 

[stillp]

That area under the glass at the rear of the cockpit would have been finished in the Dark Green camouflage colour, and something has happened to that.

So would the Dark Green have been applied before the cockpit was glazed, or was the glazing removed for painting that part, or was it just brush painted under the canopy?
Pete

 

[stona]

So would the Dark Green have been applied before the cockpit was glazed, or was the glazing removed for painting that part, or was it just brush painted under the canopy?
Pete

What do you reckon?



And




Incidentally, if an interior area was painted black/Night it would have been the interior of this, the forward section. A Lancaster fuselage was assembled from three sections.

 

[stillp]

Can't really see the camo painted ones clearly enough, but the ones nearer the camera clearly have the canopy fitted but don't yet have the dark green. What would that light colour be - primer, silver dope? I can't imagine they'd spray inside the canopy without overspray getting on everything, but cellulose dope doesn't brush very well. Did they use dope, or an oil-based paint?
Pete