discussion Not a Moment to Lose… Battle of the Bulge, Ardennes, December 1944

[rtfoe]

There is some patchy snow on the ground in places.......3:19 into the video shows a building on the other side of the road and beyond it you can see the results of a previous snowfall, also in the foreground on the camera side of the road is also snow covered.
Should make for a very contrasty and interesting bit of weather conditions for the dio. :thumb2:

B/W film footage is sometimes quite hard to distinguish the landscape. In the past I always thought the Western Plains were very desert like in cowboy movies as the grass were tan.:rolling:

Cheers,
Wabble

 

[Guest]

When did the snow start falling? They always get it wrong in movies.

That’s because they didn’t bother to read this

For these 5 days, 23 to 27 December, the weather had favored the Americans, in the air and on the ground. Superior numerically in tanks, the Americans benefited more than the Germans from the sure footing the big freeze provided for armor. However, on 28 December, the sky was overcast with low stratus clouds. This was followed a day later by arctic air from Scandinavia, which produced heavy snows, blizzards, and greatly reduced visibility at ground level. Vehicular movement was slow, the riflemen exhausted themselves wading through the drifts, and the wounded (those in a state of shock) died if left in the snow for half an hour or more. This was the state of the weather when, on 3 January, the Allies began their final counterattack.

 

[scottie3158]

Hello stranger, good to see you back with another great build.

 

[TIM FORSTER]

Snow or no snow?

The whole snow / no snow thing is probably incapable of resolution. We all know that in hilly areas - especially those high above sea level - the climate can be pretty local. Also, if snow has already fallen some days before, patches can linger on hill sides and in crevices where the sunlight cannot reach. I'm often up in the Peak District near Buxton and Bakewell and I've seen that happen many times.

Having said that, if you look at the other famous German newsreel clips from around the same time it's clear that it wasn't snowing during the early stages of the advance and it's hard to see much evidence of recent snowfall. Even where it might be visible, it is impossible to accurately verify the timing and location.

The images from Poteau don't show any snow and the footage below (which actually made it back to Germany and was shown in a newsreel at the time) also shows no signs of the white stuff. They include the well-known sequence of Kamfgruppe Peiper advancing into Stoumont - an attack which began during the morning of the 19th.

But, then again, look at this rather grim image taken in Honsfeld (on the way to Malmedy and the sight of the infamous massacre), which shows elements of Fallschirmjäger-Regiment 9 stripping boots from the bodies of killed GIs. Honsfield was captured on the morning of the 17th December, with Malmedy being overrun later the same day.

For obvious reasons these images did not make it into the German cinemas at the time. Not only do they suggest that these Americans had been summarily executed - they also show the rather parlous state of the attacker's equipment at an early stage of the campaign.



For obvious reasons this shot must have been taken soon after the battle and, as we can see, there are clumps of snow at the side of the road, on the outbuilding in the background (but not the main roofs of the houses) and, it seems, over the fields in the distance.

Honsfield is about 15 kms northeast of Kaiserbarracke, but it may be further above sea level for all I know. Either way, it seems that there had been recent snow fall in some parts of the area of advance even if the snow would not return in any meaningful way for some days ahead.

So I may allow myself to include some snow after all...

 

[Mini Me]

As you should.....it is quite evident that it was there in abundance in certain locals, so why not, I'm quite certain it would only add to the overall effect and conclude for certain that the temperatures were well below a comfortable level. :thumb2:

 

[Andy the Sheep]

Hoping to be somehow useful, I made some researches in my library and found these pics
and it confirms that the paratroopers on that Konigstiger had lost their way to their unit (9th FJ regiment) and were attached to the 501 heavy panzer battalion.
The source is this one

It's not a first class piece of historic literature as it seems mainly aimed at laundering the image of the Waffen SS, but, being written by former members of LSSAH, I think it is a reliable source for names and places.

 

[Mini Me]

Not heard of that ref. before Andy.......good to be able to connect names to places. Thanks for the info. :thumb2: :thumb2:

 

[TIM FORSTER]

Thanks so much guys, that is invaluable info.

Looking for the right building

So this next bit was fun - even if a bit slow. I went onto Google Maps Streetview and followed a few routes away from the Kaiserbarracke crossroads in the direction of German advance.

All the time I was looking for buildings that a) looked like traditional farm houses and b) looked old.

Here is a selection of what I found:











I was not trying to find a specific building to replicate, but a type: i.e. a typical farmhouse that would look authentic for the place and the time. Of course, all of these buildings will have changed over the intervening 70 or so years (although Google images are often several years old) - but you can still see that they are OLD.

Among some of the common features I noticed was the combination of a barn (with a large arched doorway) alongside the farmhouse itself. Of course, this is a classic look for rural buildings in many parts of Europe, including where I live in the UK.

This immediately brought on a rush of nostalgia and made me think of the classic Verlinden ruined barn that I had built as a teenager back in the 80s…



I guess this makes sense, since Francois Verlinden was Belgian and would have based his diorama construction sets (DCS) on structures that he was familiar with.

On many of the buildings I found on Google Maps I also saw a distinctive sloping element to the roof at the gable ends. This helps to break up the outline and gives them a much more ‘rural’ look, although I’m not sure what practical purpose it served.

So this gave me a few ideas about how my building should look.

Another image helped me to understand the method of construction. You will notice here that the stone courses might appear random, but every now and then they are roughly levelled with a line of smaller stones. The stones at the corners are also better ‘dressed’ to help keep the structure square. So it's not quite as random as it may first appear...



So having found my inspiration the work is about to begin…

 

[adt70hk]

Good to see you back Tim. Looking forward to seeing another masterclass. Was lucky enough to see your previous dio in person at one of the MAFVA nationals a couple of years ago!

ATB.

Andrew

 

[Guest]

Hello Tim, good to see you back on the bench.
Building - pics 3 & 4 look about right, the other two look far to 'new' build.
Enjoyed the history lead up to your build and like JR, chair drawn up ready for a build lesson.
Mike.

 

[Guest]

Francois Verlinden was Belgian and would have based his diorama construction sets (DCS) on structures that he was familiar with.

Though Verlinden was from Lier, near Antwerp, which is not very close to the Ardennes At least far enough away, both physically and culturally, that building styles can be pretty different. Still, that wouldn’t stop him from basing some of his kits on real buildings as seen in the Ardennes, of course.

 

[rtfoe]

Thanks so much guys, that is invaluable info.

Looking for the right building

So this next bit was fun - even if a bit slow. I went onto Google Maps Streetview and followed a few routes away from the Kaiserbarracke crossroads in the direction of German advance.

All the time I was looking for buildings that a) looked like traditional farm houses and b) looked old.

Here is a selection of what I found:











I was not trying to find a specific building to replicate, but a type: i.e. a typical farmhouse that would look authentic for the place and the time. Of course, all of these buildings will have changed over the intervening 70 or so years (although Google images are often several years old) - but you can still see that they are OLD.

Among some of the common features I noticed was the combination of a barn (with a large arched doorway) alongside the farmhouse itself. Of course, this is a classic look for rural buildings in many parts of Europe, including where I live in the UK.

This immediately brought on a rush of nostalgia and made me think of the classic Verlinden ruined barn that I had built as a teenager back in the 80s…



I guess this makes sense, since Francois Verlinden was Belgian and would have based his diorama construction sets (DCS) on structures that he was familiar with.

On many of the buildings I found on Google Maps I also saw a distinctive sloping element to the roof at the gable ends. This helps to break up the outline and gives them a much more ‘rural’ look, although I’m not sure what practical purpose it served.

So this gave me a few ideas about how my building should look.

Another image helped me to understand the method of construction. You will notice here that the stone courses might appear random, but every now and then they are roughly levelled with a line of smaller stones. The stones at the corners are also better ‘dressed’ to help keep the structure square. So it's not quite as random as it may first appear...



So having found my inspiration the work is about to begin…

Good to see you back at the bench Tim, referencing can be a great mojo booster when you discover the images you want and just perfect for your dio.

Though Verlinden was from Lier, near Antwerp, which is not very close to the Ardennes :smiling3: At least far enough away, both physically and culturally, that building styles can be pretty different. Still, that wouldn’t stop him from basing some of his kits on real buildings as seen in the Ardennes, of course.

He's at least nearer then anyone of us to get real on ground references of the battle area. I can't remember him ever explaining in detail of his dios except for a ruin or farm house in a certain battle and thats all.

Cheers,
Wabble

 

[Guest]

He's at least nearer then anyone of us to get real on ground references of the battle area.

True — I strongly suspect I’m one of the closest (but not the closest) here, and it’s about half the distance again from where I live compared to where Verlinden was.

I can't remember him ever explaining in detail of his dios except for a ruin or farm house in a certain battle and thats all.

Probably because he was not much of a historian-modeller, more a modelling-modeller His models give me the distinct impression that as long as it looked at least plausible, it was good enough for him. Which, of course, probably makes it much easier to produce better diorama scenes than trying to go for strict historical accuracy.

 

[rtfoe]

True — I strongly suspect I’m one of the closest (but not the closest) here, and it’s about half the distance again from where I live compared to where Verlinden was.


Probably because he was not much of a historian-modeller, more a modelling-modeller :smiling3: His models give me the distinct impression that as long as it looked at least plausible, it was good enough for him. Which, of course, probably makes it much easier to produce better diorama scenes than trying to go for strict historical accuracy.

You are correct on both counts Jakko. :smiling3:
Was he from Liege or Lier?

Cheers,
Wabble

 

[Guest]

Lier in Flanders where they speak Dutch, not Liège (or Luik as it’s called in Dutch) in Wallonia where they speak French.

As far as I can tell, this (the red marker) was his model shop:

View attachment 491799

 

[rtfoe]

Lier in Flanders where they speak Dutch, not Liège (or Luik as it’s called in Dutch) in Wallonia where they speak French.

As far as I can tell, this (the red marker) was his model shop:

And in between that they speak Flemish:smiling2:...thanks for that Jakko. Brings back memories of where dioramas began for many aspiring modelers.

I think we better steer back... sorry about that Tim, nostalgia got ahead of me regarding Verlinden.

Cheers,
Wabble

 

[Guest]

And in between that they speak Flemish:smiling2:

Small correction: Flemish is not a language It’s simply a collective name for the dialects of Dutch spoken in Flanders — “southern Dutch”, in other words. There are minor differences in vocabulary, pronunciation and grammar between northern (Netherlands) and southern (Belgian) Dutch, but people from the two regions can hold a conversation with zero misunderstanding if they want to. Or a lot, if they deliberately pick words the other side probably won’t understand

 

[TIM FORSTER]

Good to see you back Tim. Looking forward to seeing another masterclass. Was lucky enough to see your previous dio in person at one of the MAFVA nationals a couple of years ago!

ATB.

Andrew

Thanks Andrew,

You will see me at the next MAFVA (and I will be at Telford before that) - but I'm not making any promises about bringing a finished diorama!

See you then...

 

[TIM FORSTER]

Hello Tim, good to see you back on the bench.
Building - pics 3 & 4 look about right, the other two look far to 'new' build.
Enjoyed the history lead up to your build and like JR, chair drawn up ready for a build lesson.
Mike.

Thanks Mike,

I know what you mean about the buildings that look new. But I'm pretty confident that the first two are pre-war.

A lot of things can happen to a house over the years, to be sure, but the basic shape and building materials often remain unchanged.

Having looked at some images taken at the time, it is often surprising how 'new' some buildings appear even then. Take rendering, for instance. That was seen as quite modern back in the forties, but these days people like to strip it back to the older stone look.

The brick window surounds seem to be a common feature from what I have seen - although, of course, they are hidden if the walls have been plastered over. I especially like the shallow brick arch over some of the windows - this will be a feature if mine.

Anyway, let's see how it turns out!

 

[TIM FORSTER]

Jacko, Richard, I am more than happy to go on a bit of a nostalgia trip where Verlinden was concerned - although perhaps he deserves his own thread!

My first inspiration towards 1/35 armour modelling came with my very first issue of Military Modelling magazine in January 1977...



I was only 8 years old at the time, but the images of Verlinden's US halftracks with amazing painting and scenic backdrops made me realise that I needed to up my game from Airfix and Matchbox kits. Next stop: my local toyshop (which also had a decent selection of Tamiya kits)!